Ireland Today

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Ireland Today

Postby Pondero » October 23rd, 2017, 11:08 am

If your mind is your brain and your brain is just material , would you rely on it?
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Val » October 23rd, 2017, 11:51 am

Pondero wrote:https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinion/ireland-tragically-abandoning-catholic-teaching-on-abortion

No comment at the moment!


The rag posted "How has Ireland, a nation that so long prided herself on fidelity to the Catholic faith and love of children and the family, reached this point"

Look at the history of the Catholic in Ireland and how it kept those who followed it practices underfoot and in ignorance and then covered up for those who abused them, maybe then you might see why

On the eighth amendment, the people will decide nest June
At the moment women who want abortions just go to England so nothing will change other than the cost, the real issue is on proper education and counselling not idiotic frenzied pro lifers protesting
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Pondero » October 23rd, 2017, 11:57 am

What do the Irish know more now than when the church "kept them in ignorance."? Val.
Are the people any happier?
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Val » October 23rd, 2017, 1:55 pm

Pondero wrote:What do the Irish know more now than when the church "kept them in ignorance."? Val.
Are the people any happier?


Yes Leslie they are happier and now, our young can now go to college in Ireland or the UK based on their endeavour not on the nod from their priest.
You are lucky you didn't have to live under their regime; you and others without links to Ireland do not know what it was like to live under the Catholic church of the time.

Any job in any department of the civil service was awarded only to those that kowtowed to their local clergy, similar with any job worth looking for; the reference had to come from the priest, maybe it was different in big cities, I do not know.

This was not the case with the rich and those in positions of power; they wined and dined with the upper echelons of the church and that passed down to the local clergy their sons and daughters were looked after, there were two classes back then, the haves which the clergy mingled with and have-nots .

This is why the Catholic Church lost its hold on the real Irish people; the church is dying here, from 2008 until 2014 only 26 men joined the priesthood and according to local news only 7 remained to graduate, they had to raise the retirement age to 75 but even with that the parishes are dying with closed churches and mass once a month usually on a Saturday evening.
They are bringing priests in from Africa, Brazil and the Philippines but even there the fall away is greater than the demand, it must change or die and I think Francis knows this
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Pondero » October 23rd, 2017, 3:53 pm

The Catholic Church is dying everywhere Val, not just in Ireland.it is the same here .
It is not just the Church's fault entirely, the Irish Press, media and George Soros and his organizations that are seeking a New World Order,he is a billionaire.You have or had a couple of female politicians in Ireland that contributed to the weakening of faith too.
The answer is not to further try to change Church teaching, but to re establish what God gave us.
Catholicism is a divinely establshed religion emanatng from it's Jewish past.Like Judaism it will continue on.

EDIT
Just to clarify, the Catholic Church won't die , it will just diminish, and then recoup over the coming years.It has done this up and down movement throughout all its history, and will do so again until the end of time. Our Lord said ".. and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it.
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Pondero » May 27th, 2018, 11:31 am

After the recent change to the Constitution about abortion being now allowed, some commentators say that this change was not unexpected as the moral social scene in Ireland has been deteriorating since the visit of John Paul II to Ireland 39 years ago. After the debacle of the twenty fifth it has now collapsed.
What have they got to replace the effectiveness of the Catholic faith in their lives
This is what the Irish Times said of today's youth recently.
Treasa Fox, a spokeswoman for Psychological Counsellors in Higher Education, said most students seek help when they face issues such as social anxiety, panic attacks, acute stress, persistent worrying, phobias, withdrawal and isolation. An inability to problem-solve or cope with normal life challenges, alcohol and substance misuse, acting out in class or with peers, along with self-harm or suicidal thoughts or actions are also common issues. ‘Anxiety issues are showing more in lecture theatres and in practicals, so another substantial part of our work is to provide consultation and guidance to academic staff who encounter this in their daily interface with students’, she said.”

from a tertiary source, not first hand.
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Pondero » May 31st, 2018, 3:04 pm

I have read that Savita Halappanavar died in Ireland in 2012 because she was denied an abortion. I agree that this was a factor in the minds of those who voted "Yes" to remove the Eighth Amendment. But, was it true though. She died after septic poisoning and complications due to medical mistakes by doctors treating her.
Wikipedia gives one the full story.An abortion would not have helped. Also, when a woman was in danger of death the Eighth Amendment would have allowed an abortion.So what on earth was going on there!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_o ... lappanavar
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Val » June 11th, 2018, 7:11 pm

Pondero wrote:I have read that Savita Halappanavar died in Ireland in 2012 because she was denied an abortion. I agree that this was a factor in the minds of those who voted "Yes" to remove the Eighth Amendment. But, was it true though. She died after septic poisoning and complications due to medical mistakes by doctors treating her.
Wikipedia gives one the full story.An abortion would not have helped. Also, when a woman was in danger of death the Eighth Amendment would have allowed an abortion.So what on earth was going on there!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_o ... lappanavar


Leslie, if you search deep enough you can find excuses for just about anything.

Indian dentist Savita Halappanavar died of sepsis in a hospital in Galway in 2012, she died because the foetal heart was still beating (quotes from her husband) on arrival at the hospital she was examined “The doctor told us the cervix was fully dilated, amniotic fluid was leaking and unfortunately the baby wouldn’t survive.” The doctor, he says, said it should be over in a few hours.
As they all knew that baby couldn't survive she asked that they induce to end the pregnancy, they said no because of the Eighth Amendment their hands were tied as they could be charged with murder, plus it was a catholic country and members of the clergy were on the hospital board, she continued in agony for a further two and a half days, the foetus was removed she went into shock and died of sepsis later that day.

A leading obstetrician stated on TV at the time that the law governing abortion and the restrictions on doctors was a joke because the woman would have to be on the point of death before they could induce, if there was a foetal heart beat just like the case of Mrs Halappanavar.

BTW I voted no as I believe that 12 weeks is far too long to make a decision, I think better sex education and contraceptives are the answer.
But of course our caring Catholic church denied us both for years.
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Pondero » June 14th, 2018, 10:51 pm

The death of the Indian woman was a rallying cry for all who wanted freedom of access to abortion which meant for a start the removal of the Eighth Amendment.The Irish public got their wish.What is next?
As I have pointed out before, some of the young attractive women who flew from foreign countries to vote in Ireland for the removal of the Eighth acted as if they were going to a birthday party it was a deliriously happy moment for them when they voted "Yes". Their decision of course will lead to untold murders in the womb of innocent Irish children who will never see the light of day. God is not mocked and their punishment will be great, unless they repent and do penance .
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Re: Ireland Today

Postby Lyn » June 14th, 2018, 11:04 pm

Did you read a word of what Val wrote, Pondy?
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