Israel and the future

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Israel and the future

Postby Val » November 7th, 2016, 7:26 pm

Why is Israel doing secret deals with Russia? Is it a bid to get protection from Iran and Hezbollah and especially Syria where Russia has a vested interest in, a promise to return the Golan Heights then an alliance with the old enemy Russia on Syrian territory, new trade deals, protective military bases, repatriation* of thousands of Russian Jews, and more, just wondering if they can trust each other? I was reading recently that the US is getting fairly annoyed by these meetings and any future dealings between Israel and Russia, so what do Thaddeans think of this nearly new alliance
My candle burns at both ends;
It will not last the night;
But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends—
It gives a lovely light!

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Re: Israel and the future

Postby GregB » November 7th, 2016, 8:04 pm

I'm not aware of any secret deals as such nor any suggestion of some kind of alliance being forged between the two nations. There has certainly been collaboration in the area of anti-terrorism, specifically radical Islamic terrorism, which is not only a direct threat to Israel but also to Russia. There has also been collaboration, especially between the militaries, over the war in Syria, mainly with the object of avoiding fortuitous clashes between Russian and Israeli forces in the Golan terrain.

Iran and Hezbollah are sworn enemies of Israel, which the former has threatened to destroy and the latter as a proxy of Iran would probably engage in any military action against Israel (it has literally thousands of missiles in southern Lebanon aimed at Israel.) I think it extremely unlikely that Russia could change any of that. It's also unlikely that the Golan Heights would ever be returned to Syria; they're just too strategically important for Israel and whatever the ruling power in Damascus, be it Assad or the rebel forces (the latter very doubtful now), they would still be hostile towards Israel.

Trade deals? Quite normal. Protective military bases? Where? Russia has a naval base in Latakia on the Syrian coast and military bases in the interior, but Israel has no part in any of that. Repatriation of thousands of Russian Jews? If you mean from Israel to Russia, there would be no compelling reason for that and it's now 25 years since the collapse of the Soviet Union, enough time for any Russian Jews who wanted to return to their homeland (which those still in Israel would regard as now being Israel anyway.) As for America's reaction, on the one hand given Putin's increasing hostility towards the West and NATO there would probably be concern about any improvement in Russian-Israeli relations and, on the other, there is Obama's coolness towards Israel and his dislike of Netanyahu.
"The wiles of dissembling fate afford us the illusion of freedom, yet in the end always lead us into the same trap."
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby SwordOfTheSpirit » November 8th, 2016, 1:49 pm

Here's a link which may be of interest?

October 2016 will mark 25 years since Russia and Israel officially restored diplomatic relations after the Soviet Union severed them in 1967 following the Six Day War. ...

Link: The Maturing of Israeli-Russian Relations
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby Lyn » November 8th, 2016, 3:15 pm

Thanks Sword.
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby Sprocket » November 9th, 2016, 1:58 pm

Israel had better start looking for other international friends - Trump will no doubt nuke Russia before long.
Treason doth never prosper: what's the reason?
Why, if it prosper, none dare call it treason.
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby GregB » November 9th, 2016, 2:13 pm

Well, that shows little grasp of international relations within the American political system. Apart from the fact that Trump seems to have established some kind of ad hoc rapport with Putin, the plain fact is that an American president cannot just do what he wants as he is constrained by the Constitution and the enshrined division of powers, which means that no one agent (president, Congress and Supreme Court) can impose its will on the others. And Trump is a declared friend of Israel so it has nothing to fear, and everything to gain, from the new Washington administration.
Last edited by GregB on November 9th, 2016, 4:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby Val » November 9th, 2016, 2:19 pm

Sprocket wrote:Israel had better start looking for other international friends - Trump will no doubt nuke Russia before long.


Israel is running out of friends especially in the west so that is why they have leanings towards the state of Russia, but I think they will pay a very high price for that friendship, I cannot see Trump causing any problem for Putin whom he has shown great respect for.
Trump stated recently " Mr Putin is doing a great job” in “rebuilding Russia,” and Putin called Trump a “talented person” last year, so there is a great deal of mutual respect, don't forget that Trump is not a politician and has no interest in politics, money is his game; he is a very cagey businessman who will use his new influence to further his empire.
My candle burns at both ends;
It will not last the night;
But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends—
It gives a lovely light!

Edna St. Vincent Millay
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby GregB » November 9th, 2016, 2:25 pm

Well, my immediate response to Val's post is to say that Israel is not running out of friends at all; on the contrary it's gaining them, including Sunni Islamic states like Saudi Arabia, which fears the rise and domination of Shia fascism in the shape of Iran and its proxies. Realpolitik, Val, not sentimentaloid misconception.
Last edited by GregB on November 9th, 2016, 4:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby Val » November 9th, 2016, 2:45 pm

I like a bit of sentimentalist twaddle, it goes well with a nice single malt, I will get back to you later Greg as work calls here and I must away, but IMO Israel is reaping the wild wind, Hezbollah have access to new technologies provided by Russia in July one of their drones crossed into the Golan heights to map IDF positions, Russia later claimed it was one of theirs, but it is widely known that Russia provided Hezbollah with 30 of these drones over the last 15 months, and they would have no reason for a covert flyover as Russian planes are given safe passage in Israeli airspace.
My candle burns at both ends;
It will not last the night;
But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends—
It gives a lovely light!

Edna St. Vincent Millay
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Re: Israel and the future

Postby GregB » November 9th, 2016, 2:50 pm

Much ado about nothing. Any Russian aid to Hezbollah is limited by its wider concerns in the region while Israel has the military means to defeat Hezbollah if it comes to war, but the terrorist organisation is tied up in the Syrian civil war at present so it is unlikely to launch an attack on Israel in the foreseeable future.
"The wiles of dissembling fate afford us the illusion of freedom, yet in the end always lead us into the same trap."
- Jean Cocteau
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