Obama's legacy

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Obama's legacy

Postby Sprocket » January 21st, 2017, 11:47 am

Some disappointments, but much good. I think this article is fair and balanced. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/18/opin ... .html?_r=0
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby GregB » January 21st, 2017, 2:08 pm

I'd recast your assessment as 'some good but many disappointments'. A careful reading of the entire article (by a columnist for the New York Times, a notably liberal, pro-Democrat newspaper, who nevertheless displays an admirably coolly objective - and, as you say, balanced - assessment of Obama's presidency, warts and all) shows I'd say, on balance, that the more negative aspects outweigh the few positive ones, above all in foreign policy.

In an increasingly dangerous world, the latter is a supremely important element in the American administration, but Obama failed largely in that area (the article discusses that) and "he took the presidency’s already overlarge role in American life and magnified it further — raising, through his own transformational-bordering-on-messianic political style and reluctant-but-substantial embrace of the imperial presidency, both perfervid fears and unsupportable expectations" (from the article.) In an interview on American TV, one commentator, when asked what Obama's legacy was, replied succinctly "Donald Trump", something the article stresses, too, in the last few paragraphs.
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Theophilus » January 22nd, 2017, 9:20 pm

It depends on perspective. I do not know in detail the legacy of Obama with respect to domestic policy, so cannot make a judgement on the arguments and counter-arguments about whether he has left the U.S. in a better state than when he first became president. But, as Greg says, for the rest of the world foreign policy is of particular importance and it is here where Obama and his administration (including Clinton of course) have blundered in the Middle East, Africa and the Ukraine.

From that point of view, a seemingly isolationist president who has good relationships with Putin (even if they're from self-interest) and Israel* is absolutely the best thing for the rest of the world, regardless of whether his domestic policies hurt the U.S. or not. An isolationist POTUS could help temper the destructive and destabilizing march of globalism (emboldened by the Obama regime) and thus shoot the fox of far-right populist parties in Europe. I say "could" not because of Trump's capabilities or lack thereof, but because whether it happens or not depends more upon how the rag-tag of leftists, liberals and globalists react to Trump's presidency. So far, not so good. It's a [problem, because there isn't a lot of time before the French and German elections this year.






*Obama was frequently criticized for not having a good relationship with Israel. This was in stark contrast to previous U.S. administrations so it was interesting to see if less overt support of Israel helped calm down the situation in the Middle East. It demonstrably didn't, hence my comment - even though I am by no means an ardent supporter of Israel myself.
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Pondero » January 23rd, 2017, 8:22 pm

I am surprised at how fast President Trump acts: on Sunday he cancelled by executive order funding of Planned Parenthood, (Obama's pride and joy). Today, by signing executive orders he cancelled US participation in the TPP, Trans Pacific Partnership. (Canada and Mexico were in it too, we Canadians are hopeless now without US participation) But, it is good for Canada. I never did agree with the liberal mind set on free trade. Then in minutes he prevented abortions being paid for by the US abroad ( I think he means by NGOs Non Government Organizations) another good thing. Finally, and the afternoon is not over yet President Trump froze civil service hiring in the federal government except for military people.
What next, move the American Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem?
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Lyn » March 14th, 2017, 4:53 pm

Very fair, Sprocket.
My biggest disappointment is that Guantanamo hasn't closed but it has drastically reduced it's occupants so that's something.
No president is able to achieve all their objectives, on balance Obama has done quite well and will go down in history as such.

Obama does appear, unless we hear of any currently hidden scandal in the future, to have been a decent man with integrity.

(Now, no-one seems to want a decent person as a politician - or even a real politician, they are fed up with politic-speak - hence idiot Trump.)
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Pondero » May 6th, 2017, 11:17 am

Isn't it incongruous that Obama can't stop interfering in the affairs of another nation , by endorsing Macron who is running for office as President of France. Obama is out of office, yet he and Clinton accused Russia of interference in the last American Presidential election.His hypocrisy knows no bounds.
“ignorance of the fact that man has a wounded nature inclined to evil gives rise to serious errors in the areas of education, politics, social action, and morals” (#407).
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Lyn » May 6th, 2017, 2:13 pm

I don't think it is hypocritical to give an opinion. We air our opinions about all sorts of things, some of which don't affect us in the least but that is free speech.
Obama isn't being hypocritical, he can say what he likes especially now he has no political power and people can choose to take notice or not. Just like any of us when we get on our soap boxes, difference being we don't have high profiles so no-one will read what we say in the press.
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby GregB » May 6th, 2017, 5:31 pm

It's not hypocritical; it's unethical as ex-presidents do not normally express negative opinions about their successors in the cheap, spiteful way that Obama, whose whole political programme was unworkable twaddle, has done. Fortunately, his 'legacy' can now be written on the back of a Venezuelan postage stamp (if they're still being printed.) When Obama expresses his opinion, he is clearly trying to influence the course of events and he has already created a political foundation to oppose and, if possible, unseat the current president. (And given its extent and financing, it certainly is an attempt at alternative political power.) Trump may be a blundering idiot who bounces from one position to another like the silver ball on a pinball machine but he is the duly, legitimately elected president of a democratic state and that should be respected until the next electoral round.

Moreover, it was wrong of Obama to stick his oar in and try to influence the outcome of the French presidential election, as if he is some oracular voice delivering holy writ from Mount Olympus. Macron is clearly a far better choice than the awful Marine Le Pen, but the French people don't need the endorsement of an interfering, failed, grossly conceited American politician.

Meanwhile, the egregious bad loser Hillary Clinton bleats about the reasons for her defeat in an interview with the dreadful Christiane Amanpour of CNN, blaming it on everything (eg. FBI director James Comey's last minute letter about her illegal email server) except her own elitist arrogance, widespread unpopularity and the Democrat party's lofty ignoring of its former rust belt constituency states, now in dire straits, in favour of the West Coast and Eastern Seaboard (above all New York) pampered progressivist rich useful idiot elites.
"We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time."
- T.S.Eliot 'Four Quartets'.
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Pondero » May 7th, 2017, 1:35 am

To criticize​ Russia for doing something to the USA which he, Obama , has done to France is hypocrisy. It is obviously unethical too. I do wish ex Presidents would not interfere in the affairs of another nation and not try to influence the outcome of France's Presidential election.
Our ex Prime Minister ,Mr.Harper has kept his mouth shut since leaving office and chosen a non po!itical profession to earn his living.His is a good example to fo!low by all ex politicians.
“ignorance of the fact that man has a wounded nature inclined to evil gives rise to serious errors in the areas of education, politics, social action, and morals” (#407).
Catechism of the Catholic Church.
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Re: Obama's legacy

Postby Sprocket » May 7th, 2017, 7:40 am

I wish someone would convince Tony Blair of that!
Brendan Behan once went on a lecture tour of Canada. On his arrival, a reporter asked him why he'd come to Canada. Behan replied "I saw an advert that said 'Drink Canada Dry', and I thought 'I'll try anything once!'"
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